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Post by justan on Apr 11, 2003 18:01:56 GMT -5
Alex as valid as your points may be, this thing has just begun. Let them at least finish the fighting first. later
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Post by Cine_Man on Apr 11, 2003 19:28:12 GMT -5
Well, this IS the Politik forum.
Many years ago I had the opportunity to do a little bit of work on a documentary about Paolo Freire (check sp., it was nearly 20 years ago), who wrote a book called "The Pedagogy of the Oppressed".
I do remember in an interview he said that the leaders of most Third World Nations did NOT want their citizens to be educated.... because they would want change. There is nothing more dangerous than a bit of knowledge. I don't know what the solution is. What would happen if everyone in the world aspired to the "American" standard of living....? I admit to being (well I'm not physically) fat and happy (or really happy for that matter).... but comfortable, swanning about in my northern town with its complacent oligarchy. damn, I won't be able to organize a last-minute flight before the Concorde goes out of service, but, you know I'm not a jet-setter, either.... I've heard the snipe that you see the same kind of opulence in many cities throughout the world (compared to Saddam's palaces) while a few destitute and homeless wander the streets.... but not everyone in the "West" can even imagine the oppression and destitution of the average person in what should otherwise be a very comfortable and happy middle-class nation-- by being kept ignorant, a population doesn't aspire. (edit add) How do the religiously fundamental view the act of "desire"....isn't it a moral transgression to be ambitious? Aren't you just supposed to humbly accept whatever God metes out? Wanting something better is the work of the Great Satan.... it is the stain of craven consumerism....oh well. Quite frankly, knowing a bit about how the UN "functions" (I'll call it that), if they get in there it will be pork barrel and corruption no matter what. The technocracy and bureaucracy completely numb the imagination. Jump starting an anarchy into full-fleged democracy will be a magic act that I am just dying to see....
Cine_...
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Post by El Sid on Apr 12, 2003 6:40:00 GMT -5
About your latter point. It would interesting to interview some familys who lost relatives during their struggle for freedom against Apertheid in SA. Justan, The Truth and Reconciliation Committee conducted many, many of these interviews. All part of the restitutionary an conciliatory processes that will continue for a long time yet to come. All so very neccessary for this newfound "Rainbow" country of ours. Try this link: www.doj.gov.za/trc/index.htmlTry it. Read also the register of reconciliation. Many people from all walks of life have written here. From here, neighbouring countries and even further abroad. Even the USA. I am no softy but I do have compassion for my fellow SA's who suffered. Please read it. Not only you but the other members also. It may just give an indication of why I am so against any act of terror or even war for that matter. The book "Cry, the Beloved Country" by Alan Paton is good background for the sadness we expeienced here. So, here we are, actively working on a new SA where we can say : "Sing, the Beloved Country
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Post by justan on Apr 13, 2003 16:55:24 GMT -5
Thanks for the link ElSid, I shall be happy to check it out.
Yes I read the book and saw various movies about the book. It was a very sad and ironic set of circumstances which brought these two gentlemen together to form some sort of understanding.
Thanks again
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Post by alexmd on Apr 14, 2003 8:39:52 GMT -5
COUNTDOWN TO THE APOCALYPSE Monday, April 7 As far as educating peoples ignorance, I'm afraid you would have little chance against Islamic fundamentalists who believe that all infidels should die, you're dealing with their religion. Well i think they're like that exacly because of education, but not the good kind. I guess there would be 2 sides to "education" and you just pointed out the second: brainwashing basically. I magine that if those people would be educated diferently from birth they would act diferenly.
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Post by justan on Apr 14, 2003 13:50:12 GMT -5
From the USA today.
North Korea. In what analysts say could be the most important shift, North Korea appeared to end six months of demands for private meetings with U.S. diplomats, signaling it might acquiesce to U.S. insistence that any talks take place within a larger forum, with neighbors such as South Korea, China and Russia present. Iran. Former Iranian president Hashemi Rafsanjani was quoted in an interview published Saturday as urging a resolution to the "problem of Iran-U.S. relations," which were broken during the Iranian seizure of U.S. hostages at the U.S. Embassy in Tehran in 1980. Rafsanjani suggested either a national referendum or a ruling by an advisory body that he heads.
Israel. In an interview Sunday with the dovish Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said the U.S. victory in Iraq had sent "shock waves through the Middle East ... There is therefore a chance to reach an (Israeli-Palestinian) agreement faster than people think."
Sharon repeated previous comments that he would be willing to make "painful concessions" for peace. But for the first time he mentioned two Jewish settlements on the West Bank, Shiloh and Beit El, as places he might be willing to concede. Even so, Sharon warned not to expect too much. "It will be impossible to budge Israel on the major matters that are principles of her existence," he said.
I think it was a brilliant idea by the Pentagon to make this war a real-time one by letting the world watch the march through Iraq via the embeds. McLuhan would be proud.
Alex If I'm not mistaken I think they found some mobile WMD factories buried somewhere south of Baghdad. Being checked even as we speak
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