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Post by Topcontender on Mar 24, 2003 21:25:43 GMT -5
Palestinians in Ramallah are celebrating Iraq's capture of American and British soldiers.
A policeman at Yasser Arafat's battered headquarters today said the news made it a "big day for the Iraqi people and all the Arabs and Muslim," the Jerusalem Post reported.
"Everyone here was happy ... to see pictures of American soldiers in Iraqi custody," the officer said. "This is a big blow for Bush and Blair. I don't believe they will be able to continue with the war now that many of their soldiers are being killed or taken prisoner."
The Post said one of the policeman's colleagues in Arafat's presidential guard, Force 17, said the news made him so happy that "I felt like kissing all the people around me."
"Saddam has once again proven that he is a great leader, a defender of Arab rights," he said. "His men are brave. They have been able to teach the American and British dogs an unforgettable lesson."
The Iraqis, he said, "are much better at war because they have more experience."
"The American and British soldiers are cowards and spoiled kids," the Force 17 officer said.
'Oh beloved Saddam, bomb Tel Aviv'
The Jerusalem paper described the mood in central Ramallah's Manarah Square as euphoric.
"They have just shot down two Apache helicopters," an excited merchant shouted hysterically as he ran out of his shop. "This is unbelievable. The Americans are losing the war. Iraq is going to be Bush's Vietnam."
Adorned with Iraqi flags and posters of Saddam, the square has been the scene of daily demonstrations, the Post said. The streets were deserted this morning, however, when locals gathered in front of TV sets – many in the shops and cafes – to watch the broadcast of a defiant speech by Saddam.
Shortly after the speech was aired, about 50 girls in green and white school uniforms marched toward the square with signs denouncing U.S. "aggression" on Iraq, the Jerusalem paper reported.
The girls were greeted by shopkeepers and others with "Allahu Akbar" [God is great] as they chanted, "Oh beloved Saddam, bomb, bomb Tel Aviv."
Some of the girls, who were younger than age 10, urged the Iraqi leader to destroy Israel.
"Oh Saddam, we love you, why don't you annihilate all the Jews."
They also had a message for President George W. Bush and pro-Western Arab leaders.
"Bush, soon Saddam will bury you,"and "[King] Abdullah [of Jordan], your people don't want you, we hope you will follow your father."
'Only dictator is Bush'
A Palestinian journalist said the capture of coalition soldiers brought a sense of pride to Palestinians after morale had been dampened in the first few days of the war.
"Until yesterday, the feeling here was bad," he told the Post. "But when the pictures of the American prisoners and bodies of soldiers were shown on TV, there was a lot of excitement. It's very moving to watch Arab soldiers … defeating American and British soldiers and killing them."
The journalist added that "Saddam is now more popular than ever."
"The people here adore him," he said. "The feeling here is that Saddam has restored Arab confidence and dignity."
Footage of elated Iraqi villagers and militiamen waving their rifles next to an Apache helicopter stirred Zuhair Karajeh, a 42-year-old laborer, as he ate in a diner.
"The Iraqis are very brave and we are proud of them," he said. "An old man with a rifle was able to shoot down one of the world's most advanced helicopters. Did you see Bush's face when he was talking about his prisoners last night? It was great to see this big devil almost breaking into tears."
Karajeh does not see Saddam as a dictator.
"I would like to see Saddam as the leader of the Arab and Muslim world," he said as others in the café nodded in agreement. "The only dictator is Bush, who has waged a war against the Arabs and Muslims."
Hasan Kamleh, 37, a hotel receptionist, says he expects the war to end soon because of the U.S. and British casualties.
"The Americans and the British can't put up with the losses," he said. "They will have to end the war ahead of time because they are losing too many soldiers. Honestly, I didn't believe that Saddam stood a chance, but when I saw the bodies of the American soldiers, I understood that this is a war which the Arabs could win."
Palestinian Authority media also reflected the euphoria expressed on the street.
"On the fourth day of the war, Iraq has presented to the Arabs and all the peoples of the world proof that it is possible to defeat the U.S.," said Hasan al Kashef, a respected columnist and senior PA official.
"On this day, the Arabs and the rest of the world have come to learn that the U.S. is not the almighty superpower that is capable of doing anything anytime," he said. "Iraq has proved that surrendering to the will of the U.S. is the result of impotence, miscalculation and a lack of will."
The largest Palestinian daily, Al Quds, ran a cartoon today that depicted a coalition pilot hiding in bushes next to the wreckage of his plane. The Post said the panicking pilot in the cartoon radios Bush to tell him that he sees a thousand Iraqis holding Kalashnikov rifles, but none of them have brought him roses and gifts.
Another cartoon in the PA's official organ al Ayyam bears the message that American soldiers will return from Baghdad only in coffins. It portrays a frightened American soldier reluctantly marching toward Baghdad with a coffin draped with the U.S. flag.
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Post by Topcontender on Mar 24, 2003 21:27:17 GMT -5
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Post by smokingun on Mar 25, 2003 0:54:37 GMT -5
TC, i suppose that these people do not see things the way that the west does. i do not condone terrorism, indeed my country has suffered the most at the hands of islamic terrorists than any other country. but it would not be too difficult to imagine that they perceive the west as wrong. a lot of them have lost loved ones, and like the rest of us, they do feel anger and at some point hatred even.
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Post by Henrik on Mar 25, 2003 2:15:26 GMT -5
TC,
What did you expect?
The problem, and the danger is that this sort of sentiment/proaganda will be more and more widely distributed in the area, succeeding in turning more and more people against the west. More or less as I predicted.....
Another thing that could be interesting to note, I had read in earlier publications, primarily American ones, that it was indeed believed that in most of Iraq the coalition soldiers would be greeted as saviours. Unfortunately we have not seen much of that yet, but rather a more persisten resistance than expected.
It must be frustrating for the military not to unleash all its power in order to avoid too much damage rather than get it over with.
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propaganda
Minnow
I dont believe a word they say.
Posts: 9
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Post by propaganda on Mar 25, 2003 2:49:24 GMT -5
That was American vanity that allowed them to believe that they would be saviours. It looks more like the opposite doesnt it?
Operation Iraqi Freedomthere you have it!
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Post by Danny Boy on Mar 25, 2003 3:20:35 GMT -5
Not only in Palestine, throughout the Arab World people are amazed that the Iraqi’s are making a fight of it. The feeling is now one of pride that an impoverished Arab nation can take on the might of America. You have to remember that, by and large, America was/is hated by all Arabs because of their support of the israel. America has really shot itself in the foot over this, as they are no longer seen an invincible.
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Post by JWK on Mar 25, 2003 3:58:05 GMT -5
That is a very narrow report... not exactly written from a neutral perspective, yet it is hard not to be disgusted by some(most) of what is said.
I think that this is a knee jerk reaction to the little amount of news that has the power to give them hope... They do not live in joyous times.
To read the comments and dismiss them straight away ignores the reasons for them saying what they say... which are inevitably more insightfull then many bother to realise.
Henrik- as you often have the tendency to make me do- i agree.
Perhaps "shock and awe" had a different effect then was intended. The Iraqi's see bombs falling, the civilian casualties broadcast on the understandably bias local news stations and then look at the leaflets that have been dropped all over and think that the two- one an image of peace and security, and the other of death and destruction- do not seem to fit.
the images perhaps outrage them rather then making them submissive puppies.
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Post by Wycco on Mar 25, 2003 8:53:10 GMT -5
Re: The Article
It upsets me, but doesn't surprise me. The US has been getting in the way of the UN over helping the Palestinian people for years (and people hate the French for the same thing).
It worries me that terrorism may become more widespred because of our attacks on Iraq...
Iraq will be a better place when we remove Saddam- but somehow I doubt the Iraqi's will be greatfull for what we've done!
Reminds me of the people celebrating in the streets post-sept 11th... that turned out to be staged for the media... I hope this article is exagerated!
Re: Shock and Awe
"Shock and Awe" techniques didn't work in WWII- I don't know why we thought they would work in the Gulf...
The whole point of "Shock and Awe" was to undermime the government and discourage the populace- exactly the same reason the Germans bombed London and the Brits bombed Dresden...
"Shock and Awe" techniques usually have the opposite desired effect- they cause the populace to rally against the attacker...
Thankfully we're being nicer this time around and not deliberately attacking civilians... but the idea is the same!
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Post by Topcontender on Mar 25, 2003 9:52:11 GMT -5
Yeah i expect resentment, but man this always gets me mad. To teach kids that crap is just wrong. I can understand the bomb tel aviv stuff, but no teaching kids this is bad.
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Post by Henrik on Mar 25, 2003 10:39:10 GMT -5
TC,
Sure it's bad. It's propaganda, they all use it.
Not that it really compares, but I wonder at present how many kids in the US believe that it was Iraq that was behind 9/11...
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Post by Topcontender on Mar 25, 2003 10:50:38 GMT -5
2% of adult sane americans dont know who is president. So a guess of maybe 5%
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Post by Henrik on Mar 25, 2003 11:09:36 GMT -5
2% of adult sane americans dont know who is president. So a guess of maybe 5% ROFL!!! Well what percentage of the US population is sane? Actually the reason I brought it up is that I have seen so many times recently, on other forums and even news articles, that it is the belief that there is a direct link between Iraq (Saddam) and 9/11. In other forums, and that includes forums with fairly well educated people, I have read things like "they attacked us on 9/11, so we should increase the bombing and not spare them..." etc. Others speaking of revenge now being made for 9/11 etc. To me that is a clear sign that a certain level of "propaganda" has certainly been effective in forming the opinion of several people in the US.
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Post by daSilva on Mar 25, 2003 11:10:55 GMT -5
Not only in Palestine, throughout the Arab World people are amazed that the Iraqi’s are making a fight of it. The feeling is now one of pride that an impoverished Arab nation can take on the might of America. You have to remember that, by and large, America was/is hated by all Arabs because of their support of the israel. America has really shot itself in the foot over this, as they are no longer seen an invincible. Indeed, Palestine always takes the most balanced view of any situation.
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Post by daSilva on Mar 25, 2003 11:12:58 GMT -5
2% of adult sane americans dont know who is president. So a guess of maybe 5% Small town America doesn't and never has given a crap about Federal politics.
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Post by Wycco on Mar 25, 2003 12:38:09 GMT -5
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