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Post by who won on Mar 12, 2003 18:32:19 GMT -5
Where is the plane wreckage in the WTC? did you see the wings hanging off the side of the building? no, but we did see one go in and it disintegrated into the building. Come on, your theories are laughable, there are plenty of witnesses to the plane hitting the pentagon.
As for Mullholland drive, great film, very weird, lets just say, its a fantasy dream that we all get awoken from somewhere through the movie
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Post by pabs on Mar 12, 2003 18:47:57 GMT -5
R22, I see what you are saying but I have seen entirely too many witness accounts to give assurance that an airplane in fact hit the pentagon.
Now if anybody really doubts that those 2000 people were killed, maybe our good friend Beef would be kind enough to give anyone here a first-hand account of what happened that day in NYC....
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Post by pabs on Mar 12, 2003 18:55:58 GMT -5
S.....
As immoral as it is, I think non-combatants have always been targetted.
These days they call it the principle of double effect: basically you need to minimize non-combatant casualties (which is one more argument for the development of smart weapons, in addition to the obvious ones). Now terrorists have always targetted civilians because it helps their basic philosophy of instilling terror and fear in the population. The sad thing is: the trend is likely to increase in the future because we don't expect many world-wide conflicts. Rather, there will be many more low-level regional conflicts (which is exactly what we have now and have had for quite some time).
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Post by Mo on Mar 13, 2003 13:15:06 GMT -5
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Post by daSilva on Mar 13, 2003 15:17:21 GMT -5
OK take the first frame of that sequence and save it to your hard drive. Then zoom the picture in, behind the yellow gate bollard you will see the airplane. The bottom of the plane is black and the top appears to be white, AA airplanes have black bottoms and silver tops to their fuselages. Furthermore I have included this picture of the actual scale of the 757 to the Pentagon, if you still don't believe the scale just compare the size of the highway next to the pentagon with the pentagon itself. And the airplane was calculated to have been travelling at 350mph, not 250mph landing speed, this plane was not landing! Far too much misinformation and paranoia here for my taste.
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Post by Fan de Mo on Mar 13, 2003 16:08:10 GMT -5
Good research Mo.
Interesting pix.
Another Thing that makes you go "hmmmmmm"
Adios
FdM
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justan not logged in
Guest
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Post by justan not logged in on Mar 13, 2003 16:27:43 GMT -5
Ahh da Silva An island of sanity in an ocean of conspiracy
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Post by 3Dglasses on Mar 13, 2003 16:43:42 GMT -5
OK take the first frame of that sequence and save it to your hard drive. Then zoom the picture in, behind the yellow gate bollard you will see the airplane And if you focus on the center part, stare at it long enough, a pink elephant should stare right back at you Da silva: I am trying, but I just ain't seeing it...It doesn't mean it isn't there. I just can't make it out... BTW Justan, Paranoia is often a version of the truth, told before its time. Good thread nonetheless...interesting people make interesting conversations... 3D
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Post by Henrik on Mar 13, 2003 16:44:29 GMT -5
da Silva, Your scale drawing is interesting, and it is true that one tends to neglect the size of the Pentagon. However, I find the following picture rather disturbing. It was taken shortly after the airplanes impact, before the upper floors collapsed. I honestly can find no trace of any airplane debris on this, and the damage doesn't look to come from a plane crashing in to the building. I understand that the Pentagon is a higly resistant building, but I still find this picture hard to explain. Simply looking at this picture, and not considering any other evidence or reports, I would say that this looks more like the result of a missile attack of some sort, than a 757 crash site.
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Post by IWIWM on Mar 13, 2003 16:46:26 GMT -5
Ahh da Silva An island of sanity in an ocean of conspiracy I take it you never read one his thread on the Scuderia Ferrari Of course, I Wish I Was Micheal
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Post by Rael on Mar 13, 2003 16:48:45 GMT -5
there are plenty of witnesses to the plane hitting the pentagon. Yes. And plenty of (my) people have seen UFOs and consider me to be the re-incarnation of Jesus Christ. So it must be true. Rael
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Post by pabs on Mar 13, 2003 16:53:08 GMT -5
I agree with Justan...thanks Da Silva for that little bit of sanity. The struggle between those of who believe an airplane hit the pentagon and those who don't almost reminds me of the people that say we did land on the moon and those who don't.
Henrik, your picture is very zoomed in and all the smoke and water doesn't allow to see the ground all that well. That's where the wreckage is supposed to be no? Furthermore, look at the sequence of images posted by Mo and you can see some debris being ejected from within the flame. Could those be pieces of the airplane being thrown towards the inside of the pentagon? I suspect most of the wreckage would be towards the inside and not on the lawn as it seems the aircraft impacted high on the structure.
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Post by daSilva on Mar 13, 2003 17:02:53 GMT -5
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Post by Henrik on Mar 13, 2003 17:04:04 GMT -5
Pabs,
Don't get me wrong (and this goes for da Silva too), I'm not saying that it was not a plane that crashed in to the Pentagon.
Still, I find some of these images disturbing. The debris you mention could very well be debris resulting from an exploding missile, the debris being part of the building. As to the plane's debris going inside, that does seem normal as the plane was travelling in that direction. But, if you look again on the picture I posted, I would have thought that some sort of visible evidence of the plane's wings would be visible. And, what I find interesting with the picture is that it is before the upper floor collapsed, and so if the plane's debris went inside, there just doesn't seem to be a big enough opening for an entire 757 to have disappeared in to the building.
It just looks strange, and certainly helps fuel the conspiracy theories.
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Post by Henrik on Mar 13, 2003 17:16:24 GMT -5
da Silva,
Thanks for the link. Only problem, it has now added another element of confusion for me:
I can't see any evidence of a ground impact in front of the Pentagon!
As for the security camera footage, I remember seeing this at the time (and have again looked at it now), and it is impossible to see a plane in those images. It can be any flying object ( a plane, a missile, superman!). Still, has anybody seen any pictures from the crash site that clearly shows any airplane debris? There must be something available....
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