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Post by CFF on May 5, 2003 10:54:31 GMT -5
Wycco - I don't suppose you'd share Who Won's IP address with the rest of us then .... so we could play the guessing game too How about the first two octets of it ?? ;D I know you won't (can't) ..... so let me put together the pieces of the puzzle *note - this is all just a hunch, and it only just occured to me ....* I recall some time ago when there was a post asking if anybody knew who WHO WON was. If I'm not mistaken, someone with his IP addy said it led to the New Jersey area. Now after Greg's May 3rd post, where she said she ~thought she knew who they were~, and wished him well (if she were correct), I connect the dots ...... and ....... let's say hello to BEEF. You know Who Won, if you are Ben / Beef, I'd urge you to bring yourself back to this forum (as Beef). I really enjoyed reading your opinions, and they seem entirely wasted over at the old F1-Live (which of late seems far more dead than alive). Just my two cents worth .... CFF
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Post by Wycco on May 5, 2003 11:29:44 GMT -5
CFF,
I'm not sure where you got NJ from- however, I shall not confirm or deny your suspicions.
Obviously I cannot give out IP addresses.
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Post by glendo on May 5, 2003 11:35:01 GMT -5
i thought it was beef too!
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Post by CFF on May 5, 2003 12:04:09 GMT -5
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Post by greg99 on May 5, 2003 18:29:15 GMT -5
Correct CFF - but Beef is in NYC, not NJ unless he has moved there after 9/11. At any rate, Beef or no Beef, I miss Beef. I have had the pleasure to speak to him on the phone and he sounded like...one of us! I am sorry he decided to leave SC, I really thought he would come back. BEEF - COME BACK!!!!!! Who Won must piss his/her pants with our guessing game...who cares? I agree SG that we must treat our guests right, but I expect the same in return, hence why I just ignore his/her posts - I don't like "talking" to a ghost. (now everybody close your eyes) (I said CLOSE) Srrh - your place or mine?
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Post by smokingun on May 12, 2003 1:41:21 GMT -5
hmmm, obviously, i've missed something. though from this thread alone, who won has posted very valid and responsible arguments. if anything some of us have got a trifle defensive me thinks.
if one of us posts as a guest to delibrately mislead the forum, that is wrong and wycco and henrik should IMO name any member they suspect of doing this.
smokingun
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Post by rick1776 on May 12, 2003 2:07:03 GMT -5
I'll put my 2 cents worth in, albeit from a slightly ignorant perspective as I havent read all the posts.
It would appear that most people are making some sort of distinction betweem us humans and the rest of the wild kingdom. Is that valid?
Other species eat a variety of animals and i dare say they do not do so out of pleasure. I eat meat and I eat it mainly out of necessity. Do I derive pleasure from it. Yes in the sence that it satisfies my hunger.
Do I kill in the name of sport? No.
My wife will attest to the fact that I am weird. I will scoop up most spiders (and any other aracnids, insects, etc) I find in the house and put them outside in the garden. Whether the spider in question is poisonous or not is irrelevant. While Im scooping up the spider I have Nadine shouting Kill it Kill it while shes on the kitchen chair (I exagerate only slightly).
I "kill" only out of neccesity. For food and to protect myself and family. Albeit I have yet to come across any bears or tigers or lions etc endangering my family down my local street.
In fact many other species kill for pleasure. Just take your typical cat. Ever seen one playing with a mouse before delivering the death. So whats the story there?
Now wheres my tofu salad and Coopers beer??
cheers rick1776
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Post by smokingun on May 12, 2003 3:05:00 GMT -5
Other species eat a variety of animals and i dare say they do not do so out of pleasure. I eat meat and I eat it mainly out of necessity. Do I derive pleasure from it. Yes in the sence that it satisfies my hunger. there is a subtle difference here rick. if you were offered a non-meat course to satisfy your hunger would you eat it? if the said course contained all the nutrition that you needed, and tasty would you still opt to eat meat because you like the taste of meat better?? if the answer to the last question is a yes, then there is little difference between you and someone who wears a fur as a fashion statement. smokingun
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Post by smokingun on May 13, 2003 0:23:08 GMT -5
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Post by rick1776 on May 13, 2003 20:03:08 GMT -5
Sorry beg to differ. Wearing a fur as a fashion statement is different to wearing a fur as a necessity.
Using that logic if I eat meat its a fashion statement. If I eat non-meat products its out of necessity??
In any case using logic in an emotive subject, there can only ever be one outcome. You will not be swayed and I have no problem eating meat products and can differentiate between cruelty for the sake of it and killing for necessity.
Ive often used this one as an example, extreme as it may be. You are droped off in the middle of no-where, you have gone 3 days without eating and a little bunny comes up to say hello. Do you pat it and send it on its way or do you eat it? There are no alternative food sources.
Does eating it constitute a fashion statement or are you satisfying a basic need. Yes I know we live in a society that provides choice and I dont have to eat meat but lets stick to my hypothetical.
I just want to know whether you fit into the category of being just a little pregnant, or will I find you dead after 6 days with the little bunny snuggled in your armpit alive and well?
cheers rick1776
PS The example is not too extreme. I once watched a survival program (before they became soaps). They had three Aboriginals and three army survival experts dropped off in the middle of the Australian desert. They were allowed to take anything with them, as long as they could carry it. The Aboriginals literally had one wooden spear each. The army guys had their full quota of kit.
Well it was a joke. After one week the army guys were all but fucked. The Aboriginals were having a party in comparison. I once had a beer with a Aboriginal at a mine site and they go through 6 rites of passage into adulthood. One of them was survival, where the elder takes them into the desert for 6 weeks and teaches them how to survive. They are not allowed to take ANYTHING with them!! Needless to say the guy was shitting himself as he was about to go through this stage.
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Post by smokingun on May 14, 2003 0:08:00 GMT -5
Using that logic if I eat meat its a fashion statement. If I eat non-meat products its out of necessity?? hmmm, somewhere along this thread, there seems to be a misunderstanding. if you eat meat merely because you like the taste and choose not to eat other non meat foods because they don't taste so good, then you become no better or no worse than someone who wears a fur as a fashion statement. i think i already answered that. survival comes first. even in not so extreame cases where eating of meat would be of some benefit due to the nourishment it provides, i say go for it. i do not take the extreame virew that all meat eaters are evil. but when we choose to gorge ourselves on meat just because a steak tastes do damn good, we are like people who wear mink furs just because they look so damn chic. some of us may not like the idea as is reflected in this thread. but that is simply the way it is. and if we do feel bad about being put in the same boat with deranged fashion idiots we need to examine why we feel so bad from within rather than bash the messenger. smokingun
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Post by who won on May 14, 2003 18:06:40 GMT -5
yes this was covered. Eating meat out of necessity is one thing. Eating meat because you like the taste of it is then pushing you into the bioundaries of wearing fur becuase you like the style.
without going over all the arguments agin yours has been covered and so to avoid tedium of repeating arguments you should read back to where your argument has been covered under the meat for gratification versus necessity stage of the discussion.
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Post by julio_montoya on Jun 25, 2003 9:18:59 GMT -5
I could never stop eating meat. It gives me energy to do all the sports i do. I dont know how some people can live whitout it.
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Post by smokingun on Jun 30, 2003 9:35:34 GMT -5
I could never stop eating meat. It gives me energy to do all the sports i do. I dont know how some people can live whitout it. welcome to the party julio eating meat because you need to as you claim and eating it for the pure pleasure of eating it are quite different things. as far as energy goes, i think you'd get that from glucose and fat. the gist of what this thread boiled down to is that people who eat meat for pleasure are no better or no worse than people who kill animals for their fur to be used as a fashion statement. it is funny and hypocritical that we deride people who use fur as fashion and yet eat meat for pleasure. smokingun
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Post by Ruby2 on Jun 30, 2003 9:54:42 GMT -5
But, if we all started to wear fur, then you would see a massive increase in the numbers of animals killed purely for their fur! So, its a good job most of us don't!
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